Beginner - How best to scan 35mm and 126 colour negatives

[gerrym]

Hi,
I recently purchased an Epsom Perfection V750 Pro with a view to achieving my 35mm and 126 square film negatives, some of which are 33 years old. I am hoping to scan and edit these using a combination of Silverfast Ai and Photoshop elements (Version 6) software. I aim to have photographs developed (Not Printed) probably in sizes ranging between 15cm x 10cm and 20cm x 15cm.
I have been experimenting for the last week with mixed results, being an absolute beginner at all this, I am not entirely sure whether I am going about the process correctly and I was hoping that you might point me in the right direction and I would like to ask a few questions.
Question 1
If I require a photograph as described above, using a 35mm film negative image, do I simply enter the Original size (35mm x 25mm) and scale at 100% - giving me an output size the same as the original?
Question 2
If question 1 assumption is correct, what Q factor and dpi is recommended and what raw file size should I expect to create for Photoshop?
Question 3
Once I have created the raw file and imported it in to Photoshop, is it best to save the edited file as a Jpeg file for photographic development and what eventual jpeg file size should I be aiming for?
Question 4
I have listed all the settings in my SilverFast installation below for the purposes outlined above, are there any changes that you would recommend where I might achieve better results, or even the same results in less time.
Thank you for your time, I hope that this all makes sense,
Many thanks,
Gerry
PS I have spent a lot of time reading through the forum and watching the videos but i was still confused hence the post.



Present Silverfast Settings:
SilverFast Ai v6.6.1r3
General Tab
Scan mode: Normal(File)
Original: Transparency
Pos/Neg: Negative
Frame-Set: Save
Frame Tab
Scan Type: 48 -> 24 Colour
Filter: None
Setting: Save
Image Type: Standard
Name: Untilled Frame
Original 3.5cm wide x 2.5cm High (Locked)
Scale: 100%
Output: 3.5cm wide x 2.5cm High (Locked)
Q-Factor: 1.5
Screen: 1260 (Lpcm)
MByte: 98.26
Dpi: 4800
Densitometer Tab
L 100 -> 100
C 0-> 0
H 0 -> 0

Options – General
Colour Model: RGB
Units of measure: cm
Densitometer Radius: 2 Pixel
Default Setting: Silverfast Defaults
Option Parameter: <Save>
Interpolation: Anti Aliased
High Resolution prescan: 1x
Preview lightness: Off
Scratch disc: Folder on C: drive
Gamma Graduation 2.00 (For HDR output box un-ticked)
Q-Factor 1.5
Reopen after SF Scan: un-ticked
Show image after scan: Ticked
Realtime correction: ticked
Edge size of soft mask: 0.00
Welcome screen:
Frame colour: Red

Options – Auto
Auto Threshold Highlight: 2 (Level Un-ticked)
Auto Threshold Shadow: 2 (Level Un-ticked)
Highlight Offset: 2
Shadow Offset: 98
Colour Cast Removal: 100 (Active box ticked)
Auto Frame insert: 10
Find Frame insert: 0
Autopip Middlefactor: -30 to +30
Auto Contrast: Box ticked
Automatic for batch: Box Un-ticked
ACR when Automatic: Box Un-ticked
MidPip Fixed Target: 50 (Active box Un-ticked)
Auto IT8 Calibration: Box ticked
Custom ICC profile name: Box Un-ticked

Options – CMS
Colour Management
Input -> None (Box greyed out – impossible to change)
Internal -> Monitor: Image Colour Matching (ICM)
Internal -> Output <RGB>
Profiles for ICM
Scanner (Reflective): Epsom Perfection V700/V750 (Box greyed out – impossible to change)
Scanner (Transparency): Epsom Perfection V700/V750 (Box greyed out – impossible to change)
Internal: Adobe RGB (1998)
Grey: <None>
Output/printer <None> (Box greyed out – impossible to change)
Rendering Intent: Perceptual
Embedded ICC profiles
Embedded ICC profile: Box ticked
Profile to embed: Adobe RGB (1998) (Box greyed out – impossible to change)
Plug & Play CMYK: No CMYK (Box greyed out – impossible to change)

Options – Special
Halftoning: No dither
Colour filter: White
Prescan monochrome: Box Un-ticked
Prescan Draft: Box ticked
Scan Draft: Box Un-ticked
HiRePP: Box ticked
Limit Gamma Slope: Box Un-ticked

Negafix
Manufacturer: Other (Most film negative have no name or details)
Type: Other
ISA: Standard

[LSI_Morales]

Dear gerryn,

Since all your questions are deeply addressed and explained in our user manual and documentation. I strongly recommend you go over the user manual and some of the addendum where the workflow is explained in detail

You can find the documentation and video tutorials following the next link:
http://www.silverfast.com/knowledge/

Cheers

[gerrym]

Dear gerryn,

Since all your questions are deeply addressed and explained in our user manual and documentation. I strongly recommend you go over the user manual and some of the addendum where the workflow is explained in detail

You can find the documentation and video tutorials following the next link:
http://www.silverfast.com/knowledge/

Cheers

Thank you for your prompt reply,
As I said in my first post, I have been through the manuals and have watched the videos; my questions have been raised because I was unable to work out the solutions to my questions from your media. Is it possible for you to attempt to answer my questions or at least be more specific which chapters of the manual I should study in more detail – your link seems to point to the complete silverfast Studio manual, where I have the Silverfast Ai version. I only need a few pointers…
Many thanks
Gerry

[LSI_Morales]

Dear gerrym,

Your questions are a bit extensive. Hence I recommended going through the manual.

Question 1
If I require a photograph as described above, using a 35mm film negative image, do I simply enter the Original size (35mm x 25mm) and scale at 100% - giving me an output size the same as the original?

Yes, it is right, 100% is the size of your original material

Question 2
If question 1 assumption is correct, what Q factor and dpi is recommended and what raw file size should I expect to create for Photoshop?

"Q factor" is just a multiplier, so actually if you change that value, you will realize that either the scanning resolution or the output size changes (not being the case with the number of pixels)

RAW file size is not only dependent of this factors but also of every motive on your image.

Question 3
Once I have created the raw file and imported it in to Photoshop, is it best to save the edited file as a Jpeg file for photographic development and what eventual jpeg file size should I be aiming for?

When you say: "is it best to save the edited file as a Jpeg file for photographic development" are you actually asking or stating?

The question is relative, it all depends on what you want your resulting picture for and what future uses will this picture have? Will you archive this picture?

In question 4 you write:

I have listed all the settings in my SilverFast installation below for the purposes outlined above, are there any changes that you would recommend where I might achieve better results, or even the same results in less time.

and further down you copied all your settings for color management

Options – CMS
Colour Management
Input -> None (Box greyed out – impossible to change)
Internal -> Monitor: Image Colour Matching (ICM)
Internal -> Output <RGB>
Profiles for ICM
Scanner (Reflective): Epsom Perfection V700/V750 (Box greyed out – impossible to change)
Scanner (Transparency): Epsom Perfection V700/V750 (Box greyed out – impossible to change)
Internal: Adobe RGB (1998)
Grey: <None>
Output/printer <None> (Box greyed out – impossible to change)
Rendering Intent: Perceptual
Embedded ICC profiles
Embedded ICC profile: Box ticked
Profile to embed: Adobe RGB (1998) (Box greyed out – impossible to change)
Plug & Play CMYK: No CMYK (Box greyed out – impossible to change)

But the problem is that those settings belong to negative scanning, if you switch SilverFast to positive or Kodachromes you will see that those settings will change.
They are also dependent on operating system. I would recommend to check the color management addendum as well as chapter 7 of the user manual to better understand this aspect.

For the other topics I recommend you to use the index of the user manual towards the end, this will point you exactly to the right pages for every topic.

cheers

[gerrym]

Hi,
Thank you for your reply and in particular your very clear answer to my question No 1 – 100% scale helps me a lot.

Question 1
If I require a photograph as described above, using a 35mm film negative image, do I simply enter the Original size (35mm x 25mm) and scale at 100% - giving me an output size the same as the original?

Yes, it is right, 100% is the size of your original material

Question 2
If question 1 assumption is correct, what Q factor and dpi is recommended and what raw file size should I expect to create for Photoshop?

"Q factor" is just a multiplier, so actually if you change that value, you will realize that either the scanning resolution or the output size changes (not being the case with the number of pixels)

RAW file size is not only dependent of this factors but also of every motive on your image.

Yes I understand that RAW file size is dependent on any number of variables within your program, but for the sake of simplicity, can you give me a rough Ball-Park Tiff file size that I should expect to create, in order to have good quality hard copy photographs developed of sizes ranging from 15cm x 10cm and 20cm x15cm. To be clear, I am mainly concerned with the selection of an acceptable dpi level as I find 4800 very slow to process – I imagine that there will be a point at which a high dpi level yields little tangible benefits?

Question 3
Once I have created the raw file and imported it in to Photoshop, is it best to save the edited file as a Jpeg file for photographic development and what eventual jpeg file size should I be aiming for?

When you say: "is it best to save the edited file as a Jpeg file for photographic development" are you actually asking or stating?

The question is relative, it all depends on what you want your resulting picture for and what future uses will this picture have? Will you archive this picture?

My digital camera creates images in the Jpeg format – I am “Asking” is Jpeg the file type I should save my scanned and Photoshoped image ready for development? I ask because I am mindful that Jpeg is a compressed file and some data will be lost in conversion – do you recommend any other file type for development?

As I have said, my intension is to develop some of the images, but I should add that I wish to archive them also. Are you suggesting that I archive the images using a file type other than Jpeg? I understand that archiving uncompressed files (Say Tiff) will require more storage space, but I will have the option to edit them further in the future if necessary. Why do you ask whether I intend to archive my pictures, sounds like I should approach this requirement differently?

In question 4 you write:

I have listed all the settings in my SilverFast installation below for the purposes outlined above, are there any changes that you would recommend where I might achieve better results, or even the same results in less time.

and further down you copied all your settings for color management

Options – CMS
Colour Management
Input -> None (Box greyed out – impossible to change)
Internal -> Monitor: Image Colour Matching (ICM)
Internal -> Output <RGB>
Profiles for ICM
Scanner (Reflective): Epsom Perfection V700/V750 (Box greyed out – impossible to change)
Scanner (Transparency): Epsom Perfection V700/V750 (Box greyed out – impossible to change)
Internal: Adobe RGB (1998)
Grey: <None>
Output/printer <None> (Box greyed out – impossible to change)
Rendering Intent: Perceptual
Embedded ICC profiles
Embedded ICC profile: Box ticked
Profile to embed: Adobe RGB (1998) (Box greyed out – impossible to change)
Plug & Play CMYK: No CMYK (Box greyed out – impossible to change)

But the problem is that those settings belong to negative scanning, if you switch SilverFast to positive or Kodachromes you will see that those settings will change.
They are also dependent on operating system. I would recommend to check the color management addendum as well as chapter 7 of the user manual to better understand this aspect.

For the other topics I recommend you to use the index of the user manual towards the end, this will point you exactly to the right pages for every topic.

Regarding my question No 4,
I included my complete program settings as I thought it would be useful for you to see whether there were any obvious wrong settings that might prevent me achieving my desired outcome i.e.15cm x 10cm and 20cm x15cm photographs and good quality Archive.

I will of course consult the index of the manual when required, problem is, sometimes it’s not immediately clear what is being discussed – hence my post. For your Information i am using Windows XP Professional.

Summary.
I realise that my questions might seem a little odd to you, but I am trying to join up the dots of my understanding in relation to your Software, Manual and videos. Added to that, is the integration of Photoshop Elements version 6 and eventual generation of good quality photographs using 35mm and 126 colour negatives. Clearly, I have a lot to get through so I very much appreciate any help you can give me. That said, I’m sure others reading this forum might benefit from this dialog.

Sincerest thanks
Gerry.

[gerrym]

Hi, still struggling with this – I would have thought that there was a direct correlation between resolution and final photograph size? I don’t see anything in the manual that discusses photographs.
Anyone…?
Many thanks
Gerry.

[LSI_Morales]

Dear Gerrym,

I will go over your previous posting first:

Yes I understand that RAW file size is dependent on any number of variables within your program, but for the sake of simplicity, can you give me a rough Ball-Park Tiff file size that I should expect to create, in order to have good quality hard copy photographs developed of sizes ranging from 15cm x 10cm and 20cm x15cm. To be clear, I am mainly concerned with the selection of an acceptable dpi level as I find 4800 very slow to process – I imagine that there will be a point at which a high dpi level yields little tangible benefits?

It is not possible to explain in a "rough Ball-Park", however what I can tell you is the following.
-The ideal printing resolution for photographs is 300 dpi
- If you want to enlarge a 35 mm slide to 20 cm you will need about 2000 lines or dots
- It means you can adjust your scanner at about 2000 dpi

Are you suggesting that I archive the images using a file type other than Jpeg?

Yes, I suggest TIFF

Why do you ask whether I intend to archive my pictures, sounds like I should approach this requirement differently?

I ask because you can create a RAW file which will be used as a starting point for any future edition (lets call this file a "digital negative"). In which case you do not now for instance which uses you might have in the future. In that case I would suggest to scan the picture at the highest resolution possible to avoid having to rescan in the future the picture again.

Now, I will jump to your last post

I would have thought that there was a direct correlation between resolution and final photograph size? I don’t see anything in the manual that discusses photographs.

As a matter of fact there is a direct correlation between resolution and the size of the file as well as the size of the printed photo. The higher the resolution, the bigger the file as well as the end photograph.

But also the motive itself, the colors, light, shadows, etc have a direct correlation with the resulting file size. To prove this you can make two scans of different pictures with exactly the same settings, you will see how the resulting files have different sizes.

The best way to understand this concepts is by working. I suggest you start practicing so you can better understand the differences between different configurations.

Cheers

[Chris A 72]

I dont feel quite so alone or inadequate, the trouble as I see it, is that the people who write the manuals think the people theyre writing them for already know how to use the system!. Like you, I want to digitally archive some old 35mm slides. I was advised to buy the Epsom Perfection V700 Photo, partly because it included the Laser Soft Imaging software. I seem unable to get beyond scanning a dozen slides on a mount and that what I get as a result - a dozen slides on a mount - then what? Like everything IT related there is always a misalignment between expectation and realisation. Now sit back and wait for the insults!

Chris A 72

[LSI_Morales]

Dear Chris

You are lucky, we are not here to insult anybody, we are here to help (if we can).

Actually your scanner is one of the best flat bed scanners money can buy at the present. What you basically need is learn how to drive it (regularly it is recommended that beginners start reading the user manual and practicing at the same time).

You want to scan twelve pictures but you only have one scanning frame comprising all your pictures, hence in the end you have one file with all your pictures in it.

We have a video illustrating how to scan slides in a batch process, perhaps it can give you a little guidance.

You can find the video at: http://www.silverfast.com/download/movie/ai-655r2_en_batchscanning_vincentoliver__en_2008-08-11.mov

An introduction to NegaFix here: http://www.silverfast.com/download/movie/se-602t37c+_en_negafix-insfse_en_2004-11-29.mov

You can find all SilverFast movies (even those that might not be relevant to you) here: http://www.silverfast.com/mov/en.html

Kind regards