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[Gregory C]

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[xander]

Gregory,

I agree with you completely. For anyone else I put a post on Negafix on LS4000 and LS8000 its more or less in the same direction.

Regards,

Xander

[xander]

I have to ad a few remarks, I got no comment on Silverfasts interface, also no comments on Silverfasts results on chromes, on my LS8000 and LS4000. But its the price on a product upgrading all the time while its not
even giving decent results on for example Negatives, HDR has got more Medium Format profiles for Negafix then the version for the LS8000, a dedicated MF scanner. I got HDR SF for LS4000 and LS8000, 3*$65,- for upgrading and still the same shortcomings is in my opinion a rip off!
This is were v**s**n comes in. It hasn't always been that good, but its upgrading all the time with a big ear for its customers, and only one time $40,-. I think its time for companies like Lasersoft (they are not the only ones) if they have an ear for their customers to do something about these crazy prices, for only half products! I wish Lasersoft would take a close look at what a guy like Ed Hamrick does, and react on it FIERCE, and don't sit back.

Sorry about the harsh words, but I'am getting quiet frustated here knowing your product could be so much better!

Regards,

Xander Janssen

Xander

[DMP Imaging]

I have to agree! I purchased v**s**n about 2 years ago and was not satisfied with the product. After hearing rave reviews on SF/Ai I purchase for my Nikon LS4000 with the IT8 option. Recently I upgraded my system and OS to 10.2 so why not upgrade SF to ver 6? Since paying the $$, SF sits alone without use while v**s**n churns away creating my images. It seem that LaserSoft was very quick to upgrade the products while not delivering the goods.

Very disappointed in LS and SF.

Still waiting for working upgrades...
DMP Imaging

[fotor]

wow, I am new to this forum. I have heard raves from the magazines about AI. I was very hesitant to spent nearly $700 on software for my Nikon 8000. Now I am hearing form all of you that it is just NOT worth it!

[ianders1]

fotor,

I think if you look a little harder, you will find that this is one of 2 or 3 negative posts out of the hundreds of postive posts. The reason for the OSX problems is caused by Apple releasing Jaguar and completely changing things around, causing Silverfast as well as many other programs not to work. Unfortunately, Apple doesn't seem to care enough to inform vendors such as Lasersoft of these changes until the new version of OSX is released, forcing them to rewrite all of their code. I am sure that Lasersoft is work as hard or likely harder than anyone else to update their software so that it works.

Whether you purchase Silverfast or not is your choice, but I and many other people are very happy with the software - don't let a few negative posts scare you off. At the very least, download and play around with the free demo.

-Ian A.

[Gregory C]

An update.

I am now running Mac OS X 10.2.1 Jaguar on an iMac (800MHz G4, 17" LCD). With that in mind, here are my current feelings about the SilverFast products.

Although Lasersoft claims otherwise on their update pages (for understandable reasons), SilverFast App v1.1.3, SilverFast HDR v6.0.1r10, SilverFast Ai (NikonM) v6.0.1r12 and Ai (Microtek) v6.0.1r11 all run well within Jaguar. The software is very stable. I have only seen two crashes while running SilverFast App and Ai (NikonM) since the release of v6.0.1r12.

I must emphasize that I am an amateur. I have never used Photoshop and hope to never need it. To me, Photoshop is a 'microsoftian' application; costing far too much and carrying too much extra baggage that I will never need. Because I'm an amateur, many of the concepts buried within SilverFast's functionality are sometimes difficult for me to understand. Traditionally, I believe SilverFast's market has been the high-end scanner technicians/photographers, but that appears to be changing with the advant of Mac OS X which is not yet supported by many of the scanner manufacturers.

Without a doubt, the more I use SilverFast, the more I understand it and the simpler it becomes to use. I believe a 'beginners basics' manual might be a good thing for SilverFast Ai because the application is actually quite simple to use once you understand it.

The Auto-Image Adjustment, Selective Colour Correction, and Dust and Scratch Removal tools are incredible. They work although 'ideal' Auto settings for Auto-Image Adjustment can take some time to understand and choose.

My work flow will generally be to create full hardware-resolution raw data files using SilverFast Ai. The raw data files will be saved in HDR HiRepp format. Whenever necessary, I will then re-scan the raw files using SilverFast HDR to produce printing/viewing JPEG files. I generally use ICE and 4x Multi-Sample to generate the raw scans and let SilverFast Ai run in the background (one of the best things about using SilverFast in OS X) while I perform other tasks. ICE and 4x Multi-Sample produces extremely nice output. I should never need to scan the film again as long as the raw scan files DVD-R discs remain readable. SilverFast HDR reads, opens and processes the HDR HiRepp files very quickly. It's great to work with.

The Job Manager has the potential to increase scan efficiency but has one fatal flaw for people like myself scanning rolls of 35mm or APS film. The Job Manager has no way of setting or copying/pasting the Original Dimensions of the 'crop' frame. This means that in general, you need to prescan each and every photo and manually set the position and size of the frame. The size can be set by either dragging the borders of the frame in the Preview window or by typing the numbers in the Input Dimensions field. The position though can only be specified by dragging the frame in the Preview window and there are no X or Y Offset values to help you keep the same frame position from one photo to the next. Prescans can take a long time to perform so using the Job Manager to scan whole rolls of film can be very time consuming.

Note. X Y Offsets are not generally required because SilverFast allows the user to save the dimensions, position and exposure settings for any frame/s. Unfortunately, these saved frame settings are not available when using the Job Manager!

I believe the Job Manager was originally created to allow people to batch scan images whose position, size and exposure enhancements differ from one photo to the next. This would probably be true for people using flatbed scanners or people scanning photos for publication from a selection of 'stock' photographs. For 'bulk' batch scanning though, Job Manager will not be very useful until Lasersoft allows Original Dimensions to be copied/pasted across multiple entries.

Note. The Job Manager is useful when using SilverFast HDR because the default frame includes the whole image. When processing previously saved HDR HiRepp images, this makes for extremely efficient bulk processing. Naming multiple files can be a headache though because (a) the individual scans can only be renamed when in Edit mode requiring a prescan, and (b) while SilverFast automatically changes the file name extension to identify the file format, it does not allow for automatic renaming when the file name already exists. If there was a simpler method to naming the files, the difficulties would disappear. I have a couple of work-around methods to experiment with and will report back if I find any workable solution. The use of Aliases and A Better Finder Rename come immediately to mind.

I only have two other significant problems with SilverFast at the moment.

The first problem is that the Negafix profiles don't seem to have correct exposure. This might be a misunderstanding of profiles on my part though . When I prescan a photo and select a Negafix profile, I expect to see a preview which is at least close to the exposure and colour of the original scene before I apply any exposure/colour enhancements. I find though that I almost always need to use a Negafix Exposure setting of at least +2.5 Stops to get reasonable exposure/brightness. But maybe I have misunderstand the purpose of the Negafix profiles. Maybe they are only responsible for removing the orange mask from the scan and have nothing to do with exposure.

The other problem that I am having with SilverFast is film strip positioning. I am scanning whole rolls of 35mm and APS film using Nikon AS-30 and IA-20 film adapters. While the APS film positions itself reasonably reliably, the 35mm film is far from reliable. While the first frame of the film may be correctly positioned, the 20th frame might be off by one or two mm forcing it slightly out of the crop frame. Sometimes, the Film Strip Offset tool works but usually it doesn't. There is also no indication in the documentation whether the Film Strip Offset tool affects the whole strip of film or just the frame being previewed. In addition, SilverFast seems to remember film strip positions between film ejections. This may lend to the confusion that SilverFast shows with relation to frame positioning. For example, if I eject a roll of film and insert it again, clicking on Prescan might actually scan the intersections of two frames with the frame gap one third of the way into the scan area. The whole film offset system has to be reset and I have not as yet found a way to do this other than quitting SilverFast and turning off the Nikon scanner between film inserts. Maybe the SilverFast guys can add something to this. I haven't used NikonScan in quite some time so I cannot remember if the film offset problem exists with NikonScan too. If so, it might be a problem with Nikon's drivers rather than a problem with SilverFast.

If some of us are upset by the current failings and limitations in SilverFast, it's because we like the software and its promise for better and more efficient scanning. It's knowing that only one or two limitations or bugs exist in the program preventing it from being the star it could truely be that makes us upset.

The cost of the program and its upgrades are not an issue. I purchased three $65 upgrades because I want to use the software on OS X and I want to support Lasersoft's development of the software. The software is definitely worth the price. It would simply be nicer though if they removed the limitations, improved film strip positioning control and added a few elementary scan-specific functions such as better file naming options and simultaneous multiple file format export rather than adding more touch-up functions.

If you are looking for great scanning software, I still think this is the best you'll find. I have used NikonScan, Microtek's software and v**s**n but I still prefer SilverFast. I definitely recommend downloading the demo and taking it for a run. If you do not understand something, ask the forum. The people here are knowledgeable and friendly. This forum is definitely another plus for Lasersoft and they do NOT censor the entries like some other companies (Apple comes to mind).

Download a demo and take it for a ride. You might be surprised.

Regards
Gregory

[ianders1]

Gregory,

The fact that you have never used PhotoShop and don't feel a need for it speaks volumes about how incredible Silverfast is. I am an avid PS user, but for scans, I find myself making little or no adjustments once their in PS. As for all the other things I use PS for, well let's just say PS is the only product that can do all of those things.

If I were just a photographer, I think the AI / HDR combo would do it for me. Good to hear that it's working on Jaguar and good luck going from Amateur to Pro!

-Ian A.

[fotor]

Well thanks for all the info on Silverfast AI. I do wonder at your calling Photoshop expensive when Silverfast AI for the Nikon 8000 actually costs more! I have downloaded demos for both Silverfast and v**s**n. Both had problems during the prescan. Silverfast looked just fine until I tried to adjust for the film size, then all the boxes started blinking and PS7.01 froze and I needed to do a force quit in OSX 1.5 (OSX 2 is in the mail to me). With v**s**n, my 6x8 transparency prescaned beautifully, but with my trying all the controls out, I needed to prescan again and from then on it wouldn't crop correctly. It always gave me a big black space at the top and cropped off 1/3 of the bottom of the slide. I tried everything including restarting my computer and the program, using "basic" settings, intermediate, etc. Nothing worked and then OSX crashed. I would be happy to pay for the real thing in v**s**n if it would work. It produced a great prescan. I would have to see a great looking demo for Silverfast before I would lay out $700 for it. Anyway, if you have suggestions on what I can do to get these demos working, I would apreciate it. I would really love to stop screwing around with this pitifull Nikon software. My operating system is a Mac G4 (older) 1G ram, OS10.1.5, Photoshop 7.01,
Nikon 8000 scanner (using mainly medium format film -pos & neg). thanks

[Gregory C]

I'm guessing that you have both Nikon Scan 3.1.3 and SilverFast installed in your OS X environment. Based on my own experience with the latest version of SilverFast Ai (NikonM), I would say your problem lies here.

The Nikon drivers have not yet been updated for OS X Jaguar while the SilverFast drivers have! These two applications are currently mutually incompatible. If you really want to give SilverFast a fair go, try performing a reinstall using the following routine:

1. Remove Nikon and SilverFast items
   Using Sherlock (since you don't have the Jaguar Finder search engine yet), search for and trash all folders and items containing the words 'Nikon' or 'SilverFast'. Empty the trash.
   
2. Run the SilverFast installer
   I would suggest installing the 'Combo' package which installs both the Photoshop plugin and the standalone application SF App. SF App is a small application that launches very quickly and is great for batch scans, raw scans or any other scans where you don't need the enhancing tools of Photoshop.
   
3. Restart your Mac
   Don't simply Log out. Restart. It's a better choice.

The latest SilverFast Ai (NikonM) installer also installs the necessary Nikon MAID scanner drivers so you don't need to install Nikon Scan. In fact, you shouldn't for the reasons I stated at the beginning of this message.
Once you restart your Mac, load film into the Nikon 8000, launch SF App, choose NikonM from the popup menu and proceed to experiment. Before playing with the various Auto and Colour Management settings, I would suggest that you perform a prescan and a final scan just to verify that it works for you without crashing or freezing. Then you can begin to experiment with the more powerful aspects of SilverFast.

Let us know if you need any more help.

Regards
Gregory

[rberchin]

I've taken your advice and eliminated all my Nikon and Silverfast components (I even trashed the System9 components); and then reinstalled the latest version of NikonM for my LS8000, and restarted. Neither the SF app nor the PS plugin recognize the scanner. I know the scanner is connected correctly because v**s**n sees the scanner and it shows up in the Apple Profile Utility. Apparently you and others are getting v6.0.1r12 to work under OS10.2.1, but I sure can't. Any suggestions?
Ron